# Concatenative languages IRC channel

## Slava Pestov — 2004-10-11 02:05:37

    Hi everybody,

    There is a new #concatenative channel on the irc.freenode.net server.

    Drop by some time.

    Slava

## Joe Bowbeer — 2004-10-19 20:54:00

    I don't see any members of the concatenative family included in the

    wonderful list below:

    Programming Languages for the Java Virtual Machine

    http://flp.cs.tu-berlin.de/~tolk/vmlanguages.html

    Even though some of the concatenative languages, such as Factor,

    compile into Java bytecodes.

    (Of those listed, Dawn could be the closest cousin, but this can't be

    determined because the link is dead.  The missing link, ugh.)

    Anyway, I think it would be nice if some contenative languages were listed...

## Slava Pestov — 2004-10-21 03:25:24

    Joe,

    the Java implementation of Factor mainly exists for two reasons:

    - For the jEdit plugin implementing Factor IDE features;

    - For bootstrapping CFactor from source, without using an existing

    CFactor image.

    While I maintain and fix bugs in Java Factor, I don't intend to add

    major new features, or do any more work on the JVM bytecode compiler.

    CFactor is simply a much more elegant, compact and well-performing

    implementation, so it is the focus of all new development.

    Joe Bowbeer wrote:

     > I don't see any members of the concatenative family included in the

    > wonderful list below:

    >

    > Programming Languages for the Java Virtual Machine

    > http://flp.cs.tu-berlin.de/~tolk/vmlanguages.html

    >

    > Even though some of the concatenative languages, such as Factor,

    > compile into Java bytecodes.

    >

    > (Of those listed, Dawn could be the closest cousin, but this can't be

    > determined because the link is dead.  The missing link, ugh.)

    >

    > Anyway, I think it would be nice if some contenative languages were listed...

    >

    >

    >

    >

    > Yahoo! Groups Links

    >

    >

    >

    >

    >

    >

    >

    >

## Joe Bowbeer — 2005-07-28 23:20:55

    Slava writes:

     > While I maintain and fix bugs in Java Factor, I don't intend to add

    > major new features, or do any more work on the JVM bytecode compiler.

    > CFactor is simply a much more elegant, compact and well-performing

    > implementation, so it is the focus of all new development.

     Yes, but..  I'm wondering if the simplicity of concatenative languages

    might be especially useful on the myriads of handsets with mobile Java

    built-in.

    These Java platforms are increasingly pervasive (hundreds of millions

    of handsets, with direct bytecode execution on some ARM versions), and

    while they are constrained in terms of CPU and memory, they are not

    unreasonably so.

    The biggest constraint is that there is no way to load code

    dynamically over the air.

    Might this be solved by implementing a simple (=concatenative)

    language on top of KVM and using this as the application language?

    (So as not to leave anyone out, C lovers can have plenty of fun

    porting Factor to BREW, the other major mobile platform.)

     On 10/20/04, Slava Pestov <slava@...> wrote:

    >

    > Joe,

    >

    > the Java implementation of Factor mainly exists for two reasons:

    >

    > - For the jEdit plugin implementing Factor IDE features;

    > - For bootstrapping CFactor from source, without using an existing

    > CFactor image.

    >

    > While I maintain and fix bugs in Java Factor, I don't intend to add

    > major new features, or do any more work on the JVM bytecode compiler.

    > CFactor is simply a much more elegant, compact and well-performing

    > implementation, so it is the focus of all new development.

    >

    > Joe Bowbeer wrote:

    > > I don't see any members of the concatenative family included in the

    > > wonderful list below:

    > >

    > > Programming Languages for the Java Virtual Machine

    > > http://flp.cs.tu-berlin.de/~tolk/vmlanguages.html

    > >

    > > Even though some of the concatenative languages, such as Factor,

    > > compile into Java bytecodes.

    > >

    > > (Of those listed, Dawn could be the closest cousin, but this can't be

    > > determined because the link is dead.  The missing link, ugh.)

    > >

    > > Anyway, I think it would be nice if some contenative languages were listed...

    > >